Forum Activity for @Jeff Stern

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

I'll add my two cents on who's processing what. I live in Ecuador and have heard of most of these bars, and can tell you some about some of them.Vintage Plantations is produced by Ecuacocoa, and as far as I know is mostly if not 100% CCN-51 beans.Republica del Cacao is produced locally by Confiteca, a large Ecuadorian confectionery manufacturer. Have heard but have no evidence that they do not produce their own liquor, but they do have their own collection centers.Caoni-Made by Tulicorp, not one of my preferred products. Personally, the flavor profiles all the products I have tried from Tulicorp just do not seem to sit well with me.Cacaoyere-Ecuatoriana de Chocolates' label, I think this is primarily sold in Europe, not the US.Kallari-contract manufactured currently by Ecuatoriana de Chocolates, though that may be changing soon as allegedly Kallari is working to build its own plant. Though I'm not sure it's exactly necessary or the best idea from an investment standpoint... from what I know there is plenty of in-country production capacity and unless you're planning to go huge (by that I mean 50+ tons a year or more in production) over night, there's no need to invest in production facilities at this time.Have seen a few of the other brands mentioned locally, but haven't heard of all of them.As to the CCN-51 and Nacional issue, my local sources tell me farmers large and small are planting more and more CCN-51 variety of cacao because of its higheryields, making the Nacional variety increasingly scarce. Anecdotally, on my recent trips to both the Quevedo/Los Rios area of the country and north to the Esmeraldas area, it's easy to spot CCN-51 and it's what you see nearly everywhere you go from the roadside. Since Nacional yields less per hectare and needs more care, it should be recognized by receiving a higher price on the market, but it rarely does. This is a big, controversial issue inthe Ecuadorian cacao industry and in the commodities trade as well, and was one of the main points brought up last year at the closing of the World Cocoa Federation's annual meeting in Guayaquil that I attended.While both types might produce a very good quality chocolate, amongconnoisseurs and chocolate lovers in-the-know Nacional definitely has aspecial standing above CCN-51. There is a lot of CCN-51 and nacional beingmixed both before and after fermentation, and once its mixed its almost impossible to tell the difference visually-though I did talk to a few buyers on commercial patios who said they can recognize it if theres a high enough percent of CCN-51 in the mix of dried fermented beans. From what I know, to develop a good flavor profile with CCN-51, it needs to be fermented on its own and with different procedures from Nacional, otherwise you will get off flavors. I buy some chocolate produced locally which is a mix of CCN-51 and Nacional, and you can definitely tell the difference from a pure Nacional bar.It might be an exaggeration to say that Nacional is already becoming scarce,but if the alleged trend continues, this may well become true, and CCN-51 will become the primary bean Ecuador produces.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

I've often asked people about the attempts to plant Arriba outside of Ecuador. Some people say it can't be done. Not that the trees won't grow, but that they have failed in that the flavor profile is not the same. Speaking with a company rep at the 2008 Fancy Food Show in NY, Republica del Cacao has claimed that the ocean currents off the coast of Ecuador make a unique passage that in someway is not replicable anywhere else and therefore creates an environment that leads to this unique flavor of Ecuadorian Arriba. They actually had a binder at their booth with various photos, one of which was this diagram of global ocean currents. El Nino does create unique environmental changes along Peru and Ecuador. Could this go along one of the theories Samantha wrote in an earlier post in this discussion?Since this was also started as a general discussion about Ecuadorian chocolate I thought it would be interesting to list the companies that produce the chocolate in Ecuador. There are quite a few and my hopes is to hear from people who have tried these chocolates and can comment on flavor profile. It's been said that the Arriba flavor profile is almost non existent, but with so many companies in Ecuador, my hope is that some small Ecuadorian company might actually have access to some very interesting beans. For example, Bouga Cacao has a 77% bar labeled Hacienda Bosque de Oro. I had this bar and think it's the most obviously floral bar I've tried. I should add that those who tried it with me didn't really agree. However, I thought it was clearly lavendar and I'm not that good at picking up floral notes. I'd like to hear what people's impressions are or know of the following companies. Granted, some of these I only know the name. Not so sure these smaller companies even have a web site and unless you go to Ecuador you probably can't get them.VintageRepublica del CacaoCaoniChchukululuCacaoyereKallariPacariFloralChocolate del Castillo (not to be confused with El Castillo del Cacao of Nicaragua)San JoaquinVincesHoja VerdeBouga CacaoVere (not really an Ecuadorian company but the chocolate is processed at Tulicorp)At least five of these companies process at Tulicorp. It might also be interesting to know more about Tulicorp and where do the other companies process.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

Here is another link of interest to those following the Arriba tales..This is portions of an article on chocolates of Ecuador from Cocoaroma magazine http://www.cocoaroma.com/chocolate/content/CROMAIssue2SampleArticleWeb.pdf

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

Sure thing, Casey, going back over my comments, I see a couple of comments (which I did way too early in the morning): Arrible is Arriba, obviously. but no so obvious and more important is a very good Ecuadorian gourmet chocolate brand, which is Cacaoyere, not what I wrote above! L

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

Thanks, fascinating -- another great addition to this discussion.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

I'm weighing in a bit late on this posting, because I stumbled across this site by accident while looking for info on molillo fungus.To some of the questions regarding cacao origin for chocolates, I can tell you that Caoni uses nacional processed by Tulicorp, which gets most of its beans from the south (Los Rios and Bolivar Provinces). Kallari gets its nacional beans from the northeast (Sucumbios). Pacari uses nacional beans as well, as does Dagoba. I do not know who processes the beans for Kallari and Pacari, but as far as I know, the only Ecuadorian outfit that turns out its own, labeled gourmet chocolate is Ecuatoriana de Chocolates, which does the Caoyere line of chocolates.As various commenters have noted here, "Arriba" is a much-abused adjective to the point where it's become almost meaningless. There was a time, I suspect when the terroir aspect gave the name a special significance as relates to origin in the reaches of the upper Guayas basin, but over time, those beans have just been mixed in with beans from everywhere else in the country. The big buyers, Kraft, Nestle, Berger are the lead culprits in this, and I shouldn't be surprised if they've thrown CCN51 stuff in with their containers of nacional, along the way.Still, amongst the Ecuadorian labels (I won't comment on non-Ecuadorian stuff), there's a trend toward regional appelation by Ecuadorian Province. Thus, you'll see Pacari, Caoni, and Caoyere products labled from Los Rios, Manabi, Esmeraldas, Bolivar, Pichincha, and Guayas Provinces, and then by percentage cacao mass.Some, but not all, of these same labels (including Plantations) use "Arriba" on their packaging, and to the extent that their beans legitimately come from Guayas, Bolivar or Los Rios Provinces (where the upper reaches of and tributaries to, the Guayas River extend), I suppose you could use the Arriba label. Still, in the most general sense, it's like the wild, wild west when it comes to use of adjectives like Arrible and Gran Cru, etc. on packaging; there's just no really generally accepted appelation protocol, so people say whatever they want on their wrappers.A couple of other observations while I'm passing through: As far as I know Plantations uses only CCN51 beans. Plantations is owned by the Crespo family out of Guayaquil, and to my knowledge, these folks grow only CCN51 and have done so since the 1980's. (CCN51 is a controversial variety, particularly from a flavor standpoint, and it's gotten almost political, in my view, so much so, in fact, that someone might consider writing an article on just why that is.)On fermentation and drying and post-harvest treatment in general, quality is erratic, to say the least. The smaller producers in particular have serious problems, but even larger outfits (that is, some cooperatives) have problems regarding humidity control, etc. Cacao and chocolate is tricky stuff, just like grapes and wine, and Ecuador's got a long way to go before it's a California or France in the chocolate sense...Anyway, you've a really nice site here, and I look forward to coming back and reading more here in the future!

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

Clay, Thanks for the translation, but it's important to note key error in last sentence: Dr. Somarriba's note in Spanish says that there is no, repeat no, evidence of a link between the genetics of the Ecuadorian (Cacao) Nacional and the Mesoamerican Criollos.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

Thanks Sam.I'd like to add the link to your article from which you extracted your quotes. Had already read this before, and think the people following along here would find it interesting.And I'd also like to add in a quote from another interesting discussion around here. Alan McClure said in Reclassification of cacao varieties : Just adding to what Clay has said, there is a paper in a journal called Tropical Science from 2004, issue 44, pp. 23-27 that is called "The first Ecuadorean 'Nacional' Cocoa Collection Based on Organoleptic Characteristics."The paper is worth a look for those interested in the issue of Nacional. This is me paraphrasing the introduction:Nacional, which has an "Arriba" floral flavor, was so damaged by Crinipellis Pernicosa and Moniliophtora roreri that hybrids were brought in with high yields and low susceptibility to these diseases. These varieties hybridized with the remaining Nacional, eroding the Arriba flavor which is now virtually non-existent.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

Thanks for the interesting quote and the tip about Dagoba.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

Thanks to all for the fascinating replies. Here is another link. http://www.ecuadorcocoaarriba.com/eng/index.php It may seem as though Ecuador chocolates should be called just that, Ecuadorian, instead of the oft used Arriba. Since this term has been used to signify just about any bean, and any flavor from Ecuador. It just seems like the fashionable label to slap on, and can further mislead the public. If we got nit-picky and somehow made them use this label only for that certain flavor, then its use as a flavor term could also lead to anyone who thinks they have a chocolate with that special jasmine taste, from anywhere, to say "We have an Arriba chocolate!" I can almost imagine every other jasmine noted chocolate being called "Arriba." There is probably no policing a thing like this, and so we'll just have to have another confusing term out there, most people don't know what it means, or there are many different versions of what it means.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

Hi Samantha:You are somehow the reason why I am in this forum. I am always looking for your contributions!Again, there is nothing wrong with CCN-51 well fermented. Next year there will be a Bolivian high-end organic chocolate in the market containing over 50% CCN-51 and as I have stated, it is a high yielding variety, with some difficulties to be familiar with. There are always two side of a coin. We go to the safe side promoting mixed varieties stands with 55% CCN-51 / ICS-95 / IMC - 67.Our company REPSA is participating in a world mapping project of "origins" to determine specific taste pattern.(I wonder how they are going to roast our small beans in a lab under standard procedure.)The project is called: COCOA OF EXCELLENCE (CoE) CELEBRATION 2009 directed by CIRAD and Event International (organizers of the Salon du Chocolat). Maybe we can pick up some credit in Paris next year.By the way. The discussion of quality and market shares has reached the next level and it is taken on by politicians and national promotion programs, dominated by Venezuela, Ecuador, Peru and Bolivia through the socialist movement. "cacao y libertad", give me a break. Viva Chocolate Boliviariano! The focus is now on who is the best and has the best "Nacional". Bolivia now wants a National Cacao Plan. The point is. There is more behind all this as you might think.Clay: The translation is ok (thanks) only a little, but important mistake:"There is NO clear link between genetics [of] the Nacional Ecuadorian the Mesoamerican and the Criollos."Cheers, Volker

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

FYI - for those of you who don't read Spanish, here is a translation of the passage from Volker's post courtesy of translate.google.com. This is a machine translation and I have only made minor spelling changes (e.g., National to Nacional, creole to criollo, etc.).The recent molecular studies (several studies Motamayor Juan Carlos, MARS, and Claire Lanaud, CIRAD) show that the cocoa Nacional of Ecuador is a genotype of a Stranger who left the Amazon Basin, crossed the Andes and settled in Ecuador and south Colombia on the Pacific coast of both countries. The geographical isolation and the development of the cocoa business in Ecuador in the 18th century and the first half of the 19 resulted in the genotype Nacional we know today. We also know that today the Nacional genotype is very mixed with other genotypes outsiders and Trinitarios grown on a large scale during the 20th century. There is a clear link between genetics [of] the Nacional Ecuadorian the Mesoamerican and the Criollos.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

Here a reply I got lately from a colleague who visited me:Dr. Eduardo Somarriba de CATIE.Los estudios moleculares recientes (varios estudios de Juan Carlos Motamayor, MARS, y Claire Lanaud, CIRAD) demuestran que el cacao Nacional del Ecuador es un genotipo de Forastero que sali de la cuenca amaznica, cruz los andes y se asent en Ecuador y el sur de Colombia en la costa pacfica de ambos pases. El aslamiento geogrfico y el desarrollo de la actividad cacaotera en Ecuador durante el siglo 18 y la primera mitad del 19 dieron lugar al genotipo Nacional que conocemos hoy en da. Tambin sabemos que hoy en da el genotipo Nacional est muy mezclado con otros genotipos forasteros y trinitarios cultivados en forma masiva durante el siglo 20. No hay una relacin evidente en la parte gentica entre el Nacional ecuatoriano y los criollos mesoamericanos. Saludos. Eduardo.The Nacional from Bolivia of which Felchlin makes the Cru Sauvage from is the only cacao source known not mixed with other hybrids (maybe there are some more spots left in the Amazon). Both are very different just looking at the bean size. The Nacional here is 65 - 75 gr/100 beans.CCN-51 is getting a favorite hybrid in Bolivia in a new production zone as well. The problem with it is that under under very humid conditions the beans start germinating in the pot still looking not ripe from the outside. The yields are fantastic which is so convincing to farmers.By the way, Dagoba bought (maybe still buys) Ecuador chocolate from Felchlin.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

Thanks! This is fascinating. More stuff to research..It's really quite amazing how many of the variables in chocolate are still being explored.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

I've been wondering if anyone has been doing something like this.. Or even utilizing different strains of yeast, acetobacter to get new and different flavors.. Please do let us know what you find..

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

In case you haven't heard yet, there is a hacienda in Ecuador that is messing with a new way of processing the CCN-51. They are taking them and fermenting them with the pulp of the beans from "arriba". They hope to impart a little of the floral aspects to them. I have a bag of that arriving next week and can't wait to try it. I'll let you know what I think.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

Sam:

As always, I am struck by the care and thought you've put into your reply.

The story goes (and you are basically right), that traders coming into the port of Guayaquil looking for the famed Ecuadorian "pepe de oro" (golden seed) were told to go "arriba" up the Guayas river to find the beans they were looking for. Today we know these areas as Los Rios, Manabi, Quevedo.

It is also important to note that the bean variety has always been called Nacional. Arriba is the name given to the unique flavor, which is not a genetic characteristic as Sam has noted because rootstock transplanted in other countries does not give rise to beans with the same flavor. So there is something about the terroir - in conjunction with that specific genetics - that results in the flavor. The Nacional flavor is likened to orange blossom with jasmine mixed in. Personally, I think the best example of this flavor I have ever tasted is the first harvest and production of Felchlin's Cru Sauvage.

I also have to agree with Sam about CCN51's undeserved reputation for poor quality. I think the photo she links to was taken on the same trip in 2005 that I was on. In this case, the pods were culled early in the week before being transported to the collection center and there was a national holiday over the weekend and a soccer match against arch-rivals Peru on Monday or somesuch so the beans had been fermenting in bags for at least five days before they were picked over to remove placenta. Unfortunately, the people doing the cleaning were not tasked with removing the rotting beans.

BTW: CCN stands for Collecion Castro Naranjal. Carlos Castro was famous cacao breeder in Ecuador, and the particular hybrid - of a trinitario with the the Nacional - was number 51. It was championed by the Crespo family and it was on their farm outside Guayaquil where we saw beans like this.

Ecuador is famous (or infamous) for its lackadaisical approach to fermentation, probably because of the convoluted market system that evolved out of the destruction of the Hacienda system of the late 1800s, brought about by agrarian land reform. The farmers aren't paid to care (for the most part) so they don't.

While in Ecuador in 2005 we visited a cocoa processor (Tulicorp) where we participated in a chocolate liquor tasting. One of the revelations of the tasting was that one of the best-tasting liquors came from CCN51 beans - that had been properly fermented. Fermented properly, it's possible to make some very decent chocolate using CCN51 beans. Certainly as good as anything made with Amelonado forastero from Western Africa.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

Excellent topic, casey. Thanks for starting it. I have nothing to add because I don't have much knowledge on the subject but will be interested to follow along and learn.

Chocolates of Ecuador -- Arriba, Nacional, CCN51

Posted in: Opinion

There is debate about the Arriba bean and whether indeed there is any such thing any longer. Some say that Arriba is one bean in a category they would like to call Nacional, and others say it synonymous with that term. Many chocolate makers using cacao from Ecuador slap this fashionable Arriba label on their packages since this carries with it the status of the fine and flavor beans.And so opening up a general discussion on Arriba, Nacional and Ecuador chocolate, and a place to gather links and references for further reading.And also specifically attempting to get to the bottom of which companies are using CCN51, and which are using "Arriba" or Nacional beans that are distinguished from that clone. What I have been told so far is that of the companies producing the chocolate in Ecuador, that Plantations uses "mainly the CCN51 clone," and that Republica del Cacao uses "100% pure Nacional beans." And if that is the case, what precisely can 100% pure Nacional mean nowadays? And the other companies who are making the chocolate at source such as Pacari, Caoni, and Kallari, what is the cacao? And what about couverture Arriba from Felchlin and Callebaut? And what is the source of cacao for companies such as Dagoba, Hachez, and Chocolove, some of which do not make their own chocolate from the bean, but who use the word Arriba?
updated by @Casey: 10/10/17 22:04:09

Difficult to find

Posted in: Classifieds ARCHIVE

Several years ago, I had the pleasure of tasting a wonderful dark bar wile visiting Vienna. The chocolate is made by Wenschitz and is called Arriba 72% Chocolat Maison Extra-Noir. In addition to the Ecuador chocolate, this bar contains pink pepper (rosa pferrer), candided lemons (zitronen), and sea salt (meersalz)--quite a sensual delight--as it says on the package!Can anyone suggest a source in the US or online for this great treat!Thanks.Dave
updated by @Dave: 04/07/25 13:00:14

Intentional Chocolate: Fact or Hooey?

Posted in: Opinion

So intentional chocolate means that the chocolatier was thinking happy thoughts while producing the chocolates and the unintentional chocolate was made by a "cold" machine? I definetely agree that this idea leans more towards the new age, but if it works how are they going to control the chocaltiers thoughts? Play cartoons? Perhaps I am too skeptical or cynical, but if it really does work I've got Wallace and Gromit videos I'll donate for the cause.

Intentional Chocolate: Fact or Hooey?

Posted in: Opinion

Pure hooey.

Intentional Chocolate: Fact or Hooey?

Posted in: Opinion

I haven't done a quantitative analysis like this since college. So, I don't remember -- is the P value that they measured good? From the language it seems so, as it affirmed their hypothesis that the added intention 'ingredient' made a difference.The interesting thing is that this study is double blind -- the participants are not aware they are eating intentional chocolate. So that tosses out the whole placebo effect argument. The sample size seemed possibly a bit small. Other factors in their life (family / work life, exercise habits, etc) also make a big difference in terms of how one feels. The groups may not have been random enough.Also, I couldn't tell but are they using the same chocolate food ingredients? Or are they pairing the intentional chocolate to a Hershey's bar or something like that. Maybe the intentional chocolate has higher concentrations of chocolate's known psychoactive chemicals.I'm skeptical of the study, but I do believe in the placebo effect as others have mentioned. Stress can be reduced and thus a feeling of being healthier can be increased by allowing yourself to be more receptive to positive thoughts.

Intentional Chocolate: Fact or Hooey?

Posted in: Opinion

This is interesting. I think there might be something to it but like Koa said a lot of it is most likely placebo in my opinion. It has been proven time and time again that if a respected source tells you that a product should do a b and c then you are more likely to believe it and have a b and c happen. In the medical community a drug only has to be 5% more effective than the placebo to be considered "effective". In clinical trials, routinely, the people with the placebo treatment show the expected improvement.I also think that is why nobody's food tastes good as mom's or grandma's. There is more of a connection to that person so our minds tell us it is better. Curious to see other opinions.

Intentional Chocolate: Fact or Hooey?

Posted in: Opinion

I know this is off topic a little, but just to let you know that Kosher food is not blessed by a Rabbi, kosher meat slaughter has a blessing on the act of performing the religious rite, but other foods are not blessed in order to become certified kosher, a rabbi or emissary of the rabbi will check the ingredients to ensure they do not contain prohibited foods. I can verify that the taste and way that kosher chocolate makes me feel (nothing special) -brought me to open my own chocolate factory!As a side note, I try to maintain a positive mental attitude while I process chocolate- but that may be the result of working with chocolate!

Intentional Chocolate: Fact or Hooey?

Posted in: Opinion

I just read a little article in "Inspiration" magazine on Kauai about this intentional chocolate, and it's definitely for the new age types. There was a fad of intentional water a while back, where there is some scientific observations that water does change with prayers/intentions. Just how water structure reflects our consciousness is a mystery. Masaru Emoto of Japan is most noted for his photographs and information on the subject. That being said, you can make the assumptions that all food and liquids, has the ability to be influenced by our intentions. With delicious chocolate, "love" is always a key ingredient. So is the placebo effect, if you think the chocolate was made by an enlightened monk, then it might just taste a little holier then thou. Hence the aspect of Kosher foods, they are blessed by a Rabbi, so it must be better for you. And if you believe they are, then they are. So what would be the difference between a spiritually blessed bar of Heresies, I mean Hershey's milk chocolate with melamine, and a plain old bar of Valrhona?What if the Dalai Lama blessed a Snickers, would it make a consumer happier? And what about Smarties (the Brit version of M+M'S)...does it make us more astute? Chocolate, like all food and medicine, is a blessing...no further action needed.

Intentional Chocolate: Fact or Hooey?

Posted in: Opinion

What is intentional chocolate? It is chocolate that has been exposed to good thoughts in the belief that when you ingest the chocolate you also ingest the good thoughts, which improves your mood even more than plain chocolate can.Fact? Fiction? Well, here's a link to the abstract of a research study in a peer reviewed journal published by a reputable publisher of said journals that says that eating intentional chocolate makes people feel better than eating un intentional chocolate.What do you think?PS. As a side note, one of the authors cited in the study is Jim Walsh, the "mastermind" behind the chocolate scam known as Hawaiian Vintage Chocolate. Just hearing that he's associated makes me skeptical. Just wanted to let you know where my bias on this is. However, that said, I see that both Drs Michael Balik and Roberta Lee (both of whom I know and respect) are contributing editors to the journal. So there may be something to it.
updated by @Clay Gordon: 04/20/15 04:17:51

Single Origin and Cacao varietals

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

Clay, color me impressed. Chateau d'Yquem? $600 a half bottle?! I know where I'm going if I've got a wine question. Oh, and I think I'm actually on the flipside of the chocolate-wine debate -- $200 is a little out of my range for wine, but I didn't think twice about purchasing the Amedei Porcelana bar (in Italy.. when the dollar was weak!) Good idea to drop the 'single' part of the phrase and just go with 'origin.' I think that's where I was getting hung up, too.So as a chocolate consumer, it would be best when comparing chocolate from different chocolatiers to ensure that the origin and year match? And the origin must also match in its specificity (both must be general region, or both must be more specific region, or both must be specific plantation) in order to be fair. Oh and the chocolatiers must also match in their honesty in the representation of their chocolate origin (either both honest or both dishonest) But, more hopefully through more consumer awareness, those dishonest chocolatiers are forced to change their ways or put out of business.

Single Origin and Cacao varietals

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

James:I don't think you're thinking wrong, but the analogy with wine goes only so far as the distinctions between bean varietals is not as well differentiated as grape varietals. Vineyards are, for the most part, monocultures of single grape varietals, so it's easy to differentiate between Cabernet Sauvignon and Cabernet Franc (for example).However, because most chocolate for the past 100 years has been undifferentiated blends, and the route from farm to manufacturer is often very convoluted and blending is the norm not the exception, the value of origin chocolate is not as well established. In the wine world, a boutique vintage of 500 cases is a common occurrence, in part because there is no ceiling on the price. An established winemaker in a good year could easily charge hundreds of dollars per bottle (at the winery) for a special limited edition. Half-bottles of a good Chateau d'Yquem can cost $600. On the other hand, if there are only 1000kg (1 tonne) of rare Porcelana beans harvested from a specific farm and the bar ends up costs $21 at retail - then that's too expensive for most people, even those who don't think twice about paying $200 for a bottle of wine.I don't like to use "single-origin" because I think it is confusing. A "single origin" Ghana doesn't make much sense as it's likely a blend of beans from several places in Ghana. I prefer the word "origin" with the idea that the origin can be very broad (e.g., an entire country; Ghana) or very specific (a single plantation; Hacienda Elvesia), or somewhere in between (e.g., a growing region; Sambirano Valley, Madagascar).There are some instances where an origin and a bean type come together. One example is the Porcelana bars from Bonnat. Not only is the bean type given (the Porcelana-type criollo) but the origin of the beans is also given - Apotequil in Peru and Marfil de Blanco in Mexico. There is a third Porcelana bar whose bean origin is given only as Venezuela without mentioning a specific plantation or area within Venezuela.

Single Origin and Cacao varietals

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

If it's not explicitly labeled with the type of cacao used, how often does a single origin (such as Ghana, Madagascar, etc) utilize only one type of cacao? In other words, if I buy single origin cocoa beans or a single origin bar, am I likely to be buying chocolate from several different types of trees?Could one make the analogy, if you were to buy a single origin Ghana, it would be like buying a Napa wine and if you were to buy single origin Ghana forastero, it would be like buying a Napa white wine, but there is no way to buy a Napa Chardonnay type of chocolate, yet? Or am I thinking about this all wrong?
updated by @James Cary: 04/11/25 09:27:36

Hawaiian Chocolate

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Being somewhat contaminated with the idea of tasting Hawaiian chocolate I even could get it. The mentioned Waialua Estate, with the Dole logo, extra dark.The taste was great, also the melt, but I am somehow confused by its texture I cant help asking myself why was it like this. Usually, the bite of chocolate remains stabile/hard in your mouth, only the surface melts. However my Hawaiian became something like toffee or chewing gum... flexible when surface melting.In my conscious chocolate consume Ive never tasted texture like this. Well, maybe in sweets, but not in a genuine chocolate. One also cannot blame the shipping there were, for example, also Dagoba squares in the same box, and they had just usual chocolate texture.I guess, something with technology should have gone wrong... And I do agree, a good chocolate requires also a good manufacturer.

Hawaiian Chocolate

Posted in: Tasting Notes

I've had he Dole Waialua Estate and the Malie Kai "dark" chocolate, undeniably there is something special happening with cacao from the Waialua Estate! With both chocolates, there is something wonderful, intriguing, interesting, distinctive going on. However, I don't feel Guittard capable of bringing to bear the potential of these beans. It's too bad that Dole and Malie Kai have Guittard as their chocolate maker, I would like to see someone else get their hands on this special stuff... I gave them both about an 8.5, because potential sensed is not realized. The milk chocolate from Malie Kai was just ho hum average milk chocolate, might as well buy a mass market product (Guittard, perhaps? Well, I guess you are, but you would get more for your money with honesty about what type of product it is... irksome)Also irksome is the marketing hype "The Rarest Cacao on Earth" on the Malie Kai label. Oh let's just drop this already! They are so special indeed that they do not need to have any cacao percentage listed on either package or website, some rather odd marketing strategies going on there, it's ridiculous that you would have to research in order to find out these simple facts.

Hawaiian Chocolate

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Hi Skip,So HVC doesn't own or grow any of their own chocolate anymore? I read on their site that they claim to have made a new distinct variety of cacao (Hawaiian).From what I gather above, HVC was sold and is now Original Hawaiian? Is that where HVC gets some of their "Hawaiian" beans?

Hawaiian Chocolate

Posted in: Tasting Notes

I'm glad to hear that your marketing will be improved so that you can reach a wider market with your excellent chocolate! Waialua Estates is one of the best I've tasted and reviewed (of >310). My review notes are attached. I look forward to tasting it again. Is it available anywhere on the mainland other than at Chocosphere?P.S.- I bought my first Waialua Estates from Melanie at Sweet Paradise in Kailua Nov 2008 when I was visiting from NC. My real name is Lowe.

Hawaiian Chocolate

Posted in: Tasting Notes

I think the Waialua Estate will be a big seller eventually, specially once the packaging (- Dole logo) and the bar size change, the chocolate speaks for itself. Farsheed, The Chocolate Guy Hawaii.

Hawaiian Chocolate

Posted in: Tasting Notes

We will be featuring Waialua Estate at our new Sweet Paradise Chocolatier Kings Shops location at Waiakoloa Beach Resort on the Big Island and I will be joint venturing with Ocean Sports on the Kohala Coast to present wine and Hawaiian chocolate tastings on a sunset sail.And Derek, that cake was really awesome!

Hawaiian Chocolate

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Clay, You are right that Waialua Estate Chocolate has not been marketed well, but we are working on that.Our website is under construction at waialuaestate.com with a few photos of the farm and processing. There will be information on both the Cacao and Coffee we grow and a listing of places where you can get bars, confections, desserts and good coffee.We also are getting more active in our public outreach with the "Taste of Waialua" events at the Old Sugar Mill in Waialua, and the Kona Chocolate Festival where we recently presented a flourless chocolate cake with Cocoa Outlet and won first place Peoples Choice Award and 2nd place for professional dessert (after Melannie at Sweet Paradise Chocolate) .So we are making our debut and listening to feedback and looking for opportunities to take our products to market.I will do my best to keep up with discussions and can be reached at info@waialuaestate.com.Aloha,Derek

Hawaiian Chocolate

Posted in: Tasting Notes

send me an email of who you contacted and I'll give you a few names.I have them at my shop.hawaiichocolate@gmail.com

Hawaiian Chocolate

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Does anyone here know of a source for Hawaiian cacao beans? I have contacted several farms directly, and cannot get a return phone call. I dont need a lot - even 1-5lbs would be enough, as this is for a Dept of Agriculture project and not for production. If anyone can guide me in the right direction, it would be appreciated.Thanks!

Hawaiian Chocolate

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Malie Kai is made from Dole's Waialua Chocolate. They sell the 55% and Milk Chocolate, also flavored bars like Kona Coffe, Lemon Mac nut etc..Dole grows and markets Waialua Estate 70%.( processed by Guittard) . They are packaged in a pack of 5 small bars and (unfortunately) have the Dole Logo on the box.To date it the best chocolate in Hawaii that is marketed, I've tasted some better that are not yet marketed.I sell all the Hawaiian Chocolate in my store, except Vintage who is not really a player here anymore. There are also many small farms producing chocolate they sell locally but do not market outside Hawaii as they don't have the means to make or wrap the bars in a manner that would allow them to be widely distributed. www.sweetparadisechocolate.com

Hawaiian Chocolate

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Aloha Olorin,Back in the mid 80s Jim Walsh left Chicago and settled in Hawaii. He wanted tostart a chocolate business and collected advanced cacao selections from Malaysia and Phillipines. These materails were planted in Keeau, east side of Hawaii island. He sort farmers who would grow and sell their beans to him. One of the farmers was a retired professor Dr. Clarence Hodges who had recently moved to Kona, west side of Hawaii island. I was on his farm when the hydralic ram dug the holes in the a'a lava field. Attached is a photo of him a year or so later. His health deteriorated, he returned to the mainland, died and his farm was purchased by Bob and Pam Cooper. They rehabilitated the orchard and built the 'Original Hawaiian Chocolate Factory'. So they are not the original commercial farm but they are as the name implies the first chocolate factory in Hawaii.

Hawaiian Chocolate

Posted in: Tasting Notes

i lived in hawaii for years and always shopped at the dole estate... when i discovered the chocolate there i never bought it anywhere else. i love the local flavour of it..... got my local coffee beans just down the road as well.wonderful chocolate.... if you visit.... dont miss it !