Forum Activity for @Sebastian

West African cocoa and Gourmet chocolate

Posted in: Opinion

In this years Cocoa of Excellence competition in Paris, 14 of the 50 cocoa's that were judged were from W. Africa. Now, many, many more were submitted, but only 50 get entered. Most of them were trying to deliver something other than conventional West African flavor profile, and many did just that. I tasted each and every one of them - some were better than others. However, there's currently a very vivid fine flavor profile that exists in many W. African countries already, predominately appealing to consumers in Europe and Japan - I'd hate to see the entirety of W. African flavors shift to something else (not that I think there's any danger of that happening, however the breadth of flavors across the world i think is quite marvelous, and to see them shrink would be less than ideal).

"Gourmet" means different things to different people. For some, "gourmet" is nothing than fancy packaging. For others, it has more to do with *absence* of flavors to give them a blank pallet to work from to allow their other ingredients room to shine. Yet others, it's defined more by the physical handling characteristics of the the chocolate (low viscosity). For some - it's very much defined by a unique flavor. W. African cocoas can deliver on all of these. The last one is probably the hardest to break into, as for many who are peripherally involved with cocoa/chocolate (even for those who believe they are experts, often times), there may be a perception gap equating W. African with bulk commodity and nothing special. Of course, that may be true 90% of the time depending on how you define your parameters; however it's also quite possible to make quite a range of products by manipulating your growing materials, the post harvest practices, and of course the chocolate production process/formulation itself.

Edit - sorry, i miscounted - i'd originally indicated 10/50 cocoa submissions were from W. African countries - upon recounting, it's 14. Time for new glasses.

West African cocoa and Gourmet chocolate

Posted in: Opinion

Thanks. Can you expand on that?

West African cocoa and Gourmet chocolate

Posted in: Opinion

Yes.

West African cocoa and Gourmet chocolate

Posted in: Opinion

Is there a legitimate role for the mild West African cocoas in the Gourmet Chocolate industry?

updated by @Alan: 04/21/15 03:10:49

Musee du Chocolat, Strasbourg: any reviews?

Posted in: Chocolate Education

http://www.musee-du-chocolat.com/

Has anyone been to this museum? Is it worth making an effort to go and visit? Is it appropriate for the experienced Chocophile, or only the novice?

Any feedback and thoughts and tips would be appreciated!

Best wishes,

Sunita de Tourreil

The Chocolate Garage

Palo Alto, CA 94301

www.thechocolategarage.com

updated by @Sunita de Tourreil: 04/13/15 01:40:42

Toffee troubles

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

Mark;

Thank you so much for taking your time to be so thorough in your answer. I will try and digest everthing you said and modify my technique accordingly.

Matt

Toffee troubles

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

The temperature you cook to will determine flavor and color. Once over 300F you are down under 3% moisture.

Doctor solids are anything dissolved in the water that isn't sucrose. This typically includes glucose syrups, invert syrup, salts, proteins, etc. They affect cook temperatures, browning rate, inversion, but are primarily used to controlsucrose crystallization, and give final desired texture and shelf life.

The added water affects more caramelization, not burning.

Rate of cooling primarily affects caramelization.

Humidity is a big factor. Once the toffee cools, it will begin to absorb moisture from the air. Needs to be below 45%RH, but below 35%RH is ideal. The sugar is in its amorphous, or glass, form rather than crystal, or solid.

Boiling the sugar and butter first is common practice. Add the sugar while stirring, and once all in, the sugar should be all in solution about the temperature it begins a full rolling boil, somewhere near 225-230F depending on the amount of water you use. A rule of thumb is the water should be a third the weight of the sucrose. Once boiling wash any crystals off the side of the pot, andyou can remove from heatto check clarity on the side of a metal spatula, just note the difference between crystals and bubbles, you can feel the crystals. You may need to wash down the sides a few times through the cook.

Reducing the heatas you near the finish helpsprevent burning.

Toffee troubles

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

Do I need to always cook to "at least 310 degrees", or only if I add water if things begin to separate?

The batches tried yesterday still tended to have that terrible "fudge like texture", unless they burned, being darker and stickier. Since you're sayingadding water can increase the chance of burning due to longer cook times, is there anything else I should try first?

What do you mean "doctor solids"?

Are you saying that above 255 degrees (if the syrup is properly "supersaturated") and if at a low enough temperature, I needn't stir the mixture at all?

As I seem to continue to have problems, I could only come up with 3 possible things which I didn't know how much they did or didn't affect things.

1. I use unsalted butter--does this make much difference (realizing that salt lowers the boiling temperature of water)?

2. I am placing the toffee into a sheet metal pan to cool on top of the wooden table (I don't have room for our marble slab at present)--I didn't know if perhaps not cooling quickly enough created additional problems?

3. Humidity seems to affect the outcome--I didn't know the significance of this, nor any adequate work-arounds.

Ruth stated that she brought the water and butter to a boil and then began to stir in the sugar. If that is the case, can the sugar be "completely dissolved in the solution" before boiling?

I know I'm having quite the fits with toffee and your help (as also Ruth's) is greatly appreciated.

Matt

Toffee troubles

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

Thanks Mark. I've always wondered why it did that. I never have a problem in the large batches in a copper kettle over an open flame, but have had a problem using an induction burner.

Toffee troubles

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

Make sure that when you start boiling the sugar that all of it is completly in solution. Wash down the sides with a brush and water, but make sure it's all dissolved. The reason it seems to separate at about 250 - 255F is that that's the point that the saturation and boiling curves intersect. If you still have crystals there, especially not using any doctor solids, the sugar will continue to crystalize out to thesaturation point of the curve, giving you the fudge like texture. Adding water can help redissolve but the additional time held hot will increase your inversion level,with enoughresulting in a stickier, darker piece with increased bitterness from the new compounds formed. Also once above the above temperatures, since the syrup is supersaturated, minimal shear will help prevent crystallization. I typically don't stirr at all, using reduced heat to prevent burning.

Toffee troubles

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

Ok (equal parts butter and sugar). Thank you very much.

Matt

Toffee troubles

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

I forgot one very important part. Weight your sugar, don't measure it. You want a pound.

Toffee troubles

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

Ruth;

Thank you extremely much! I will try it (and I'll take the "luck") :-)

Matt

Toffee troubles

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

Reduce the water to 1/4 C. Cook in a tall rather than flat pan. I heat the water and butter to a boil, then stir in the sugar. Cook on med to med high, stirring constantly. If it is going to separate, it will do it at about 250. Adding water and continuing to cook will solve the problem. You need to cook to at least 310. Good luck.

Toffee troubles

Posted in: Tech Help, Tips, Tricks, Techniques

I'm having trouble with my Toffee recipe (which is as follows);

1 # butter

2 cups sugar

1/2 cup water

bring to boil, then turn down heat tomedium-high until starts to thicken, then turn on low heat until mixture reaches 295 degrees F., then pour in pan to cool.

Half of the time, the toffee turns out well. The other half, the toffee turns dark and tends to separate, and the toffee turns cake-like.

I've tried a suggested "fix", which was to take off the heat and add 1/2 cup of hot water in the final minutes and stir well, but it didn't help (well, it stopped the mixture from separating, and the mixture didn't turn cake-like, but it didn't set up.

I don't have the background knowledge or experience to know why sometimes the toffee turns out great, and sometimes it fails. My best guess is maybe humidity changes are making a difference, but I don't know. I've tried different pans, different stoves, adding a little bit of corn syrup, etc.

Any suggestions?

Matt Erickson

(360) 601-7235

updated by @Matt Erickson: 04/11/25 09:27:36

Dominican Republic

Posted in: Travels & Adventures

You may be able to spend some time at Esmereldas by contacting the Rizek's in Santo Domingo. They'll be in the book (web).

Dominican Republic

Posted in: Travels & Adventures

I am spending a week on the Samana Peninsula of the dominican republic in January & wondered if anyone had any suggestions for any plantation tours in that area?

updated by @Helen Staines: 04/20/15 13:02:01

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

I'm a huge advocate of letting your chocolate age 3-4 weeks before finalizing a recipe; however in my experience bitterness is not one of the elements that changes significantly over age. The components that result in bitter attributes are not volatile.

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

I realize this is a very old thread, but I am just starting and coming across the same challenge. Until today I had no idea how much resting could help with the bitterness of the chocolate. I have battling the bitters for months. Today I reached into a box of chocolates and grabbed a piece of milk chocolate I had made over a week ago. Last week the bar had a bitter aftertaste. Today, I noticed none.

Normally after I mold any candy that I make, I put it into plastic bags.

My question on the resting, under what conditions should the chocolate "rest"? I typically keep my un-molded chocolate in plastic bags, but should it breathe? Have some airflow? Or should it at least be in a large container that is not airtight?

Thanks,

Mark C.

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Is the broker telling you that the whole beans you are receiving are, in effect, sterilized? If so, I would absolutely, unequivocally, insist that they demonstrate proof of that if you do not have a kill step of your own, and I'd challenge their results by having them validated yourself with a 3rd party. A piece of paper saying they're clean is meaningless.

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Hi Clay,

thank you for your help. Actually I buy the beans from a broker and he gives me all the sanitary certificates. Do you think that there is a risk ?

A read that salmonella and all the possible bacterias are killed if the temperature is 70C or more. May be for cocoa beans is different ?

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Maria -

It's not so much the difference in gross origin (Venezuela vs the DR), it's differences in the variety (genetics) of the bean modified by various aspects of terroir, and I include post-harvest processing techniques as a part of terroir.

If 15min at 140C is what works for you - then that's what works for you. Your beans, your roasting technique.

The exact times and temps for others does not really matter.

EXCEPT ... in the absence of testing, 15min at 140C does not guarantee that pathogens (e.g., salmonella) on the outside of the beans are killed to an "acceptable" level. So, you probably want to do some lab analysis on a regular basis (e.g., each new shipment of beans at least) to make sure that everything is safe.

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

I roasted today my beans from Venezuela; before roasting the beans were not acid, no bitterness, just a taste of butter.

Firstly I tried the same temperatures and time as for DR beans, just to compare the results. The result for the beans from Venezuela was: the beans developped bitterness and no chocolate aromas; I tried another roasting, at lower temperature, for 15minutes, and the flavours were so different ! beautiful chocolate taste, no acidity, no bitterness. I tasted the nibs with some cane sugar and it was delicious.

Do you think that 15min ( 140C ) is ok, or it's not too much... ? the result was good, but I see that many of you roast the beans for at least 20minutes.

Thank you in advance.

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Hi Brad,

Interesting to read! You mention your porcelana is so acidic, but why is it so acidic, you know? You mentioned that beans are not properly fermented, but from a porcelana you would expect proper fermentation isn't it?

Best

Rodney Nikkels

Amsterdam

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Here here! Science backing up what my nose tells me. Low and slow....

cheers

Brad

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Here

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Best reading are pp. 15-17

http://www.worldcocoafoundation.org/scientific-research/research-library/pdf/Ramli2006%28PostHarvestDrying177KB%29.pdf

updated by @Thomas Forbes: 09/16/15 02:47:27

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Here is an article that you and others might find interesting, I have cut in the abstract text below but it is the later section of the paper on the Sensory Evaluation of Dark Chocolate that is relevant to this discussion and is worth a read see attached file

INFLUENCE OF ROASTING CONDITIONS ON VOLATILE FLAVOR OF ROASTED MALAYSIAN COCOA BEAN Journal of Food Processing and Preservation 30, 2006, p280

Abstract:

In this study, commercial Malaysian cocoa beans (SMC1A) were roasted

in a forced airflow-drying oven for 20, 30, 40 and 50 min at 120, 130, 140,

150, 160 and 170C. The products were evaluated for flavor compounds and

sensory evaluation (as dark chocolate). The volatile fraction was isolated

using the combined steam distillationextraction procedure and was identified

by gas chromatographymass spectrometry. A quantitative descriptive analysis

was used to evaluate the flavor intensity of the chocolates using a 9-point

rating scale for selected flavor attributes, namely astringency, bitter taste,

sour taste, cocoa and burnt. Panelists were asked to smell and taste the sample

against a standard chocolate. It was found that there were significant differences

in flavor compounds between the different conditions of roasting. The

main flavoring compounds identified composed of aliphatic and alicyclic

groups such as alcohol and ester, and heterocyclic groups such as pyrazine

and aldehyde. A total of 19 volatile major components were identified:

nine pyrazines (2,5-dimethyl-, 2,3-dimethyl-, 2-ethyl-6-methyl-, trimethyl-,

3-ethyl-2,5-dimethyl-, tetramethyl-, 2-ethenyl-6-methyl- and 3,5-dimethyl-2-

methylpyrazine); five aldehydes (5-methyl-2-phenyl-2-hexenal, benzaldehyde,

benzalacetaldehyde and a-ethyliden-benzenacetaldehyde); one methyl ketone

(2-nonanone); two alcohols (linalool and 2-heptanol); and two esters

(4-ethylphenyl acetate and 2-phenylethyl acetate). Based on the flavor profile

of the compounds identified, an optimum production of the major flavoring

compounds such as pyrazine, aldehyde, ketone, alcohol and ester occurred at

160C for 30 min of roasting. Trimethylpyrazine and tetramethylpyrazine compounds

together with 5-methyl-2-phenyl-2-hexanal were found to be good

indicators for the evaluation of the roasting process. However, based on

chocolate evaluation, the best roasting temperature was 150C for 30 min,

which gave the lowest astringency and at the same time gave the lowest bitter

taste and low level of sour and burnt tastes. At 150C roasting temperature, the

desirable cocoa flavor was at its optimum. Correlation coefficients among

certain volatile flavor and sensory characteristics of cocoa beans and dark

chocolate were significant (P 0.05).

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Thank you Brad. When I was roasting with the women's groups, we were constantly checking them as they got closer to end. I noticed that the beans were not quite done, they were still a little moist and slightly rubbery. Then they were finished, they were more crisp in their bite. They were also a little dark on the outside before my mentors thought they were done.

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

I've been following this thread with interest.

I'm going to weigh in here briefly....

In my opinion, next to fermentation THE most important step in developing the flavour of chocolate is roasting, and THE best way to determine what's going on while roasting is to SMELL what's going on during the roast. 80% of your sense of taste comes from your sense of smell, which is why you can't taste anything when your nose is plugged.

Having said that, ignore the time you are roasting for, and pay attention to what your NOSE has to say about the roast.

During a typical roast, the first smell that you encounter (usually about the 1st 10-20 minutes or so) is a nice "brownie baking" smell. From there, the beans start to smoke a bit, and a very acidic/vinegary smell develops, which overpowers the "brownie" smell. At times when we're roasting, the smell in our shop becomes so acidic that my staff's eyes water a bit. This is the important stage where the acids and some of the tanninsare being driven off the beans.

Eventually, as the acids decrease, the smell then again returns to a richer, brownie baking smell, with acidic undertones. This is usually during the last 1/3 of the roast.

Our roasts (using a convection oven), are usually between 45 and 77 minutes at about 300 degrees F. Our porcelana is VERY acidic, and requires the longest roast. In order to prevent burning, we actually reduce the temperature after 50 minutes, to 250 degrees - just enough to continue driving off the acids, but preventing the beans from burning.

With regard to bitterness and astringency, there's not a lot you can do with those characteristics through roasting or conching. Those two characteristics are of beans that have not been properly fermented. At least that's been my experience.

So... In conclusion, roast your beans at a lower temperature, and listen to what your nose has to say about what's going on. Only then can you really nail down the flavour profiles of the beans you are working with.

Cheers.

Brad

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

A general rule i use for grinding in a spectra 10 is 2hours grinding for every 500g of nibs into liquor, this makes it fine enough, then add the extra stuff, cocoa butter, sugar, milk powder etc and then you need about 12h for every 1kg of chocolate youare making to get the fineness, but depending on origin you will grind / conch for longer.

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Yeah , you wil certainly have a shorter roast profile if you are roasting nibs too

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Dear Daniel,

We tested also some DR beans (organic), did two roastings, one starting at 150 C for 8 minutes and than to 130 C for another 17 minutes (25 in total). This restulted in excellent aroma, no bitterness in the nibs. The other roasting was a bit higher temp and longer, but the nibs lost a bit the cocoa and other aroma's. I think you should not go too high with the roasting, otherwise it will turn bitter, also not too long. We didn't make chocolate yet from these beans.

Best regards

Rodney Nikkels

Chocolatemakers,

Amsterdam, Holland

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Hi Tom !

We have just tried to roast our DR beans a little bit more. We roasted 100gr of nibs. 5 min at 170C, and 10 min. at 150 and 10 min at 130C. I compared the results with my first roasted beans, and what a difference !!! The first beans were very acid, and these ones have lost the acidity and they had chocolate taste.

I tried also something: I continued to roast some of the beans another 5 min. and I found that it was too much.

Thank you very much for your advices !

I am still waiting my grinder and I am wondering if 48h will be ok for the chocolate liquor. What do you think ? I will not add additional butter or emulsifiers.

P.S. sorry for my english it's not very good

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

I agree that your roast sounds a little light for the DR, however, I must tell you that in my roasting pan the beans sit about two to three deep, hence my stirring. If you have them one bean deep they heat and roast a bit quicker.I have not worked with Rio Caribe yet, but it will undoubtedly be less tannic. I would probably do something like 5 min at 170 then 20 min at 150 with no resting in the oven, I would be tasting the beans all the time to find the best end point though. I taste the beans regularly to assess how long, a good way, well the way I do it is to take out two beans, one on the big side and one on the smaller side, shell them and pop them both in my mouth with about a quarter of a teaspoon of sugar then chew it around for a bit without swallowing. With practice and knowledge of the flavours in your finished chocolate you can get a very good read on how the roast is progressing with this method. It is also really good for detecting two things, astringency and bitterness. The key is to keep chewing to get the paste nice and fine only then can you really start to 'taste' where your roast is at in terms of astringency and bitterness. Roasting is the best bit, I think, a new bean origin, a new challenge, and the house smells so damn good!

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Tom, Thomas, thank you very much to share your experience with these beans. It's so usefull for me ! So, I think, that I have to roast these beans more than 20min if the temperature is 130C. I will try later to roast the beans at higher temperatures and for 40 minutes at least, and I will compare the results.

The other type of beans I wil use is Rio Caribe, Venezuela. Have you ever worked with this type of beans ?

Thank you in advance !

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

10-15% milk powder is a good start for a dark milk choc. I findaround 10%for DR type beans and more for fruity beans like Madagascar.

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

I recently bought a small cocao town melanger and have made a dozen or so micro batches in the last month or so. Using mostly Hispanola from the DR and brought back some Sanchez and a couple of pounds "80%" Hispanola. These women cooperatives roasted, milled, winnowed and did a gritty grind and make them into 4oz balls. I also had the chance to translate this summer and see how beans are roasted in a small factory using a continuous method.

Temperatures were much lower. They set the factory roaster at around 170 C to have 115-120 C on the beans. Around 250 F. One women's group uses a pizza type oven and was going toward 350F and burning them. They were putting them in a cold oven and letting it sit for a couple of hours without attending to them. I did a roast with them and the temperatures ranged from 250F - 320F and I had it as low as it would go. It took 45 minutes in a hot oven. The other women's group is roasting in a big open cast iron pot with wood. I measured temperatures around 300F as it reached it's peak. It was about an hour as the pot warmed up and 40-45 for the remaining batches.

I am running out of paste and will have to start buying beans and I appreciate this discussion.

I did one batch of milk chocolate and wondered what percentage of milk powder do you use?

I haven't been aging my chocolate either. Too eager to start using it.

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

No worries on the help.

Maria, I have used this bean from Chocolate Alchemy, many years ago, I found it was quite astringent bean, in fact so astringent that it curdled milk when I used it to make hot chocolate. It is definitly one that needs 'resting'. I think from memory it was a cooler longer roast I used on this bean. I just looked it up in my notes and it was 800g of beans in one tray for5 min (170degreesC), 27 min (150degreesC) and then turn oven (kitchen convection)off and leave door open for 10 min then take out of oven and cool (I stir the beans every 5 mins or so during the roasting). I find this last resting in the oven with it off and the door open really developes some good chocolatey notes in the beans and reduces some of that bitterness(some beans that is, not all,I tend to use it on this type of bean and in Vanuatu as it is quite tannic too).

Dark milk chocolate is a great chocolate, if you are setting up a business. For the Australian taste, this is the type of chocolate I would be selling, it is by far and away what people here that taste my chocolate like the best.

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Tom and Maria, thank you is all I can say.Roasting and resting will be focal points for the next go!

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

Hi Tom ! Thank you for this information and the advice for dark milk chocolate.

I use Domenican Republic cocoa beans, type Hispaniola, and I don't roast them more than 20 minutes. Did you use this type of beans ?

Daniel: thanks for your answer ! I don't use a Juicer, I bought a grinder from CocoaT, I didn't use it yet. But I don't think that if you pass the roasted nibs through the juicer, they become bitter. I think that you have to try to roast the beans at lower temperatures, between 260F - 300F.

Bitterness

Posted in: Tasting Notes

I agre with Maria, aging will allow the bitterness to 'settle', I age mine after tempering but I don't think it really matters. Some origins get very bitter if you roast them too long, I have found this pronounced in beans from peru and the philippines and to some extent with vanuatu. Roasting shorter and cooler is the solution here. As a general rule astringency deacreases with roasting and bitterness increases so you just got to find the sweet spot. One more thing you can do if it is all to bitter is to make a dark milk chocolate, even just a little milk powder in the formulation can reduce bitterness significantly.