Forum Activity for @Kerry

Yup - if I'm not seeding I do.

Ok....

At Clay's request I read almost every one of the 500+ comments on the article.  Heck, I even read the article!  

I'll sum it up for you:  Superfluous Jibber Jabber.

Of the 500+ comments to the article I only found a couple of (at best) luke warm compliments to their chocolate, and ignored the plethora of comments insulting their beards.  Wow... I had no idea people hated beards that much!  Who knew??

Here is a summary of the comments I DID find on their chocolate - the words and phrases are pulled directly from the posts:

• icky
• too intense
• sh*tty overpriced chocolate
• caca
• bitter
• did not measure up
• i had to spit it from my mouth it was so awful
• my palate wasn't sophisticated enough to 'get it'
• I can just tolerate their Special Dark
• chalky and really disliked it
• I live in the neighborhood and I really wanted to like Mast Chocolate - but after many attempts - it has always been disappointing.

This company and it's founders are truly the poster children for what I've been preaching about on this site for years:  LISTEN TO YOUR CUSTOMERS!!!!

Knowing the types of machines they have, and how much volume (of PROPERLY conched chocolate) on a weekly basis each machine can produce, I can definitively tell you that Mast Bros. are taking shortcuts with respect to product in order to address demand issues.  

Those shortcuts will spell their demise.  Maybe not today, maybe not tomorrow, but within the next 5 years.  Mark my words.

I'm sure at one time they produced great chocolate.  However today, according to people who have bought it and tried it, they aren't and that very unsilent majority is spreading the word that it's crap.  They have already spread out significantly into surrounding communities.  WHY?  Because nobody in THEIR community is buying their chocolate anymore.  NOBODY LIKES IT.  

Rick Mast may disagree with me.  Maybe you do too.  But think about this for a second:  There are 2.6 million people in Brookly alone. That means in just Brooklyn approximately 25.1 million lbs of chocolate gets consumed every year.  One would think that if they made "the best", it wouldn't be hard to completely sell out AT FULL RETAIL PRICE of the tiny amount they make with a consumption pool of that size surrounding them. 

Yet they don't sell out in their shop, and have branched out to other communities, selling their bars at a wholesale price, instead of focusing locally and selling out at full retail and being more profitable.

As an analyst, this tells me their product ISN'T the best (or even close), and that they don't give a flying pinch of pigeon poop what their customers think or want - justifying their ignorance by spouting off about not caring about what the critics say, or pushing their own beliefs of good chocolate down the throats of those who enter their shop once, and most likely won't come back, as they 'aren't sophisticated enough'.

In business, refusing to listen to your customers is a great recipe for failure, and while they will make some headway in the next few years due to their funky look and the media interest in the craft chocolate industry, I assure you they won't be the media darling for much longer.  When the cameras disappear, and the media dust settles, they'll be left standing there scratching their hipster beards and saying to each other, "Hey dude... where did everyone go?".

I make and sell chocolate too, and in a city that is a fraction of the size of Brooklyn.  My team and current equipment can't keep up with local demand and it's a hell of a lot more industrial than the units the Mast Bros use.  I CAN'T expand without taking a giant leap and building a large factory, and I'm certainly not going to sell a single bar at a discount if I know we can sell it at full retail pop in the next few days!  Doing otherwise is truly stupid.  In a city of only a million people Choklat has become so popular that my shop holds chocolate and wine tasting events 4 nights a week in Calgary, and twice a week in Edmonton, and we are sold out until 2016.  Yup.  You heard it!  You can't reserve a seat in any of our events until NEXT YEAR!!!

The bottom line here is that somebody will always stand out from the crowd, and unfortunately it's all too often that the media dictates who that somebody is.  (Remember a few years ago those douches named Sacred Steve and David Wolfe, who were spouting off about "raw chocolate" all over the place?).

In this case it's the bearded hipsters in Brooklyn, and while I don't personally think the attention they are getting is a bad thing for the craft chocolate industry (after all it's creating awareness in the marketplace), I think that in time the market will dictate what it wants, and if Mast Bros. doesn't give it what it wants, they will join Sacred Steve and his funky hat somewhere in "Faded Fad Land" where they can debate the popularity of their beards vs. Steve's hat.

In the meantime I too will continue ignoring the self indulgent, pretentious critics, just as I have done in the past.  However, at the same time I WILL be listening to my customers and selling a boatload of chocolate because of it.

Cheers

Brad

With the subtitle: "Why do specialty shops refuse to carry one of the best-known craft chocolate brands in the country?"

While "hate" is a very strong word that I don't agree with, it certainly has attracted a lot of attention and comment on Slate, Facebook, and other outlets.

Here's the link to the article  and I recommend reading the comments before sharing your thoughts with ChocolateLife members.

 Slate_MastBros_bros.jpg - 79KB

I also have a real quick question which regards to tempering chocolate. Do you need to temper chocolate that contains cocoa butter and vegetable fats altogether? 

This problem is not related temperature.  It's related to physics, and understanding the behaviour of the chocolate you are working with.

When making chocolate confections, you have two compounds with different properties and different behaviours:  You have your centers, and you have your coatings.

As the centers warm and cool, they just sit there and for the most part, do nothing.  However it's important to keep in mind that some centers are softer than others, and also have more air incorporated into them than others, while other centers are dense, and less inclined to give in to slight compression.

Then you have your chocolate.  THIS IS THE CULPRIT.  As the cocoa butter in the chocolate crystalizes, it shrinks (which is why it comes out of molds very easily when properly tempered).  Chocolate with a high cocoa butter content (such as good quality couverture) shrinks LOTS, and when properly tempered, has zero maleability.

Your truffles are rolled round.

When a sphere shrinks, it shrinks inward.

You cover a round ball with tempered chocolate, and as the chocolate sets it tries to shrink.  However when it can't, something has to give, and as a result a crack appears.  It really IS that simple.

A very soft center with air incorporated into it (such as a whipped/piped ganache), will allow the chocolate to compress it and as a result will not crack.  A hard center will not give the chocolate an opportunity to shrink, and as a result many will crack.

Understanding the behaviour of your ingredients, you have a number of options:

1. Use a couverture that has less cocoa butter
2. Incorporate air into your centers by whipping them
3. Double dip your confections (the first dip will crack, but the second generally won't)
4. coat your truffles with something (which adds structure for the chocolate to grab on to and compress)
5. Use a milk chocolate to coat your confections

This lesson here is further supported by the process of molding chocolates.  The molds are poured, emptied, and scraped, and allowed to set before the filling is piped in (this gives the thin chocolate shell time to shrink).  The center is piped in, and the bottoms are poured.  Thick bottoms can cause cracking whereas uniform bottoms very seldom ever do.

Cheers and Happy Chocolate Making

Brad

The problem in this case has nothing to do with mold temperature, or fridge temperature, or even humidity.  It has to do with the type of crystal the cocoa butter has formed in the tempering cycle.

I've seen this happen many times when I'm teaching a new employee to temper chocolate.  They go through the tempering cycle too quickly, and then bar up the chocolate.  The bars at first come out of the cooler with a super nice shine, but within 24 hours, the inside of the bar turns all grainy, and eventually all look exactly like the photo.

Solving this problem is very simple.  When taking the chocolate through it's tempering cycle either:

1. Lower the cooling temperature a couple of degrees (allowing more crystal propogation)or
2. Let the chocolate remain at the cooling temperature for a longer period of time.

The problem you are having is that you are not allowing enough time for the appropriate types of crystals to propogate, BEFORE you reheat yoru chocolate to the working temperature to mold up your bars.

You also need to remember that when working with different kinds of beans and making single source varieties of chocolate, the cocoa butter in each will exhibit different behaviours, and will temper slightly differently from the others.  The tempering cycle is more of a "rule of thumb" for tempering all chocolate, but with experience, you will see that each chocolate you make will temper slightly differently.  It's not something you can just apply a boiler plate heat/cool/reheat cycle to (although for small batches you will get VERY close).

I hope this helps.

Cheers and Happy Chocolate Making!

Brad

I am able to find sources for milk chocolate truffle shells but want I really want is the shape of somethign like the cherry cordial.

This way I can place the fruit and fondant in and seal the bottom. The truffle shells have I think too small of a hole from what I can see int he pictures.

I could mold these myself, but at this point in time, I want to make a large batch with minimal effort.

So, if you know of any sources that would be great.

Thanks,

Joe C.

(1) Savage Bros- 125lb/55kg, chocolate melter/tempering unit $5,500

(1) Cotton Candy machine- Econo Floss $350

(1) Sephra chocolate fountain- 34in commercial, $2200 

(1) 6ft Federal chocolate case- FCCR-6, 72in/ Black and silver display- LED lights $6000

    Climate Controlled & Humidity Controlled,  

(1) 4ft Federal chocolate case FCC-4 $3800

138 polycarbonate chocolate molds- (all shapes and sizes) $1,932 = 14.00ea

(3)  Double sided Easter egg molds- 10in mold $150= $50ea

(1) Extra Large Easter mold- Great for display creations! $100

(1) turbo air- under counter- 2 door freezer. $900

(1) M3 Turbo Air –single door freezer, Sub Zero $900

180 -Grape wine hangers boxes (includes candy trays) $90 = .55ea

110 -white wine hangers boxes  $55 = .55ea

185 -white window baliton box $55.50= .30ea

30 – 4in square white box $2

475 -brown macaroon trays, 4pc $52.25= .11ea

22- bunny boxes $30.8= 1.40ea

23- egg boxes $25.3 = 1.10ea

26- 18pc red truffle box, (Chocolat’ Chocolat’ box) $59.80= 2.30ea

11- pink  truffle box- can be used as a 9pc or 16pc , (Chocolat’ Chocolat’ box) $14.85=1.35ea

149- sm clear heart boxes- 4pc truffle $111.75 =.75ea

750- pretzel bags - 3”x11” bag $22.50= .03ea

200- candy pads $15.00= .07ea

125- candy signs $312.50= 2.50ea

10- silver heart boxes $10.0= 1.00ea

4- flower buckets $4.00 = 1.00ea

20- lg pink and brown striped window box $25= 1.25ea

925- 5pc clear box $462= .50ea

100- spools of ribbon $200= 2.00ea

90- white gable boxes $40.50= .45ea

240- clear cylinders 4x4in $120= .50ea

400-black balliton boxes  $120= .30ea

3- hot chocolate dispensers $75= 25.00ea

300- chocolate spoon sticks $9= .03ea

75- kraft boxes- 12pc truffles $26.25= .35

30- holiday boxes 24pc truffle $45= 1.5ea

75- red window box , (holds a standard 9pc or 16pc tray) 93.75= 1.25ea

150-  red window box- 4pc $112= .75ea

1850 gold stretch bows $55.50= .03ea

70-pull bows $17.50= .25ea

150- business card chocolate boxes $30= .20ea

550- 2pc white boxes  $99= .18ea

18,000- brown candy cups $48= .002ea

50- gold trays, 4pc $5.50 = .11ea

75- black balliton boxes- 1/2lb $22.5.=.30ea

250- 9pc trays brown $30= .12ea

250- 16pc trays brown $30= .12ea

100- black balliton boxes-1lb  $30= .30ea

26- sm pink & brown $19.5= .75ea

30- gift baskets- assorted sizes $30=  1.00ea

3- feximat baking sheets  $225= 75ea

1200- clear wedding favor box- 4pc truffle  $600= .50

100- clear cylinders 2in x 6in $ 50.00= .50ea

500- clear 7pc truffle boxes $250= .50ea

1,000- clear 3pc truffle boxes $500= .50

200- burgundy boxes- 4pc truffle $100= .50

80- lg gift basket boxes $45= .45ea

40- sm gift basket boxes $18= .45ea

175- XL red window box $218.75= 1.25ea

10- plastic case trays $20= 2.00ea

150- brown bags $22.50= .15ea

6- steel tables  $600= 100ea

3 part chocolate warmer $150

150 shipping Ice packs $90= .75ea

 I will separate or as a complete package. Let me know your interest

Ph# 239-980-9753 Call or Text

Email: jschaffer@irresistibleconfections.com

Justin 

This has been fascinating and I've learned so much from this one thread. And for all the technical conversation, I'm getting that two things may be happening with Alain's chocolate:

• His molds may be too warm when he pours the chocolate in them, which is likely because it is hot in the Domincan Republic and that is where he is making the chocolate. (Peter, I had never known about this, or thought about it, but it makes so much sense - thanks for the info!)
• The fridge often has too much moisture. When chocolate is placed in the fridge during a humid season, it only makes the situation worse.  You can only use the fridge for short periods of time to shrink the chocolate and release it without spots, or moisture will accumulate and the chocolate becomes 'sticky', then bloom happens when it dries. But sometimes, if humid & hot weather, the fridge is not an option at all for me (I realize in Canada that I only have a 2-month window for this to be a problem  )

Hopefully you can solve your tempering troubles soon Alain!

so, i just looked around zürich and found some chocolate stores. Mostly Sprüngli stores but also Läderach, Teuscher and Vollenweider. Sprüngli has a big Shop in the Center at Bahnhofstraße with a cafe on the first floor.

like the other answers , the ganache is evidently too cold and, in my own experience, too soft. I have a rhubarb ganache that was really soft at room temperature so I froze it to be able to scoop it. I refroze the balls and dipped them in untempered chocolate as a first coat , the second,tempered, layer I did the following day having stored them at room temperature and one or two out of 50 bonbons cracked. I adjusted the ratio of chocolate to make it firmer and they no longer crack. I'm no physicist but the combination of freezing and lower viscosity seems to do it because I have soft filled molded pieces and they never crack or leak.... 

Hello Vera. We got the Papua Kerafat, Beni Wild Harvest & Piura Porcelana. And we're happy to sell them.

Recognized your name also from your commentary on the Tibor Szántó bars on the chocoweb-site

Nice to hear from you !

The speed you cool the chocolate is key to keeping in temper.  When the chocolate is tempered, only ~3-5% of the cocoa butter is crystallized.  Doesn't sound like much until you realize shortening is only about 15%.  If these seed crystals are small and well dispersed you're at ideal temper.  When cooling you want it to be gradual enough to pull the heat created with further crystallization and slowly cool.  If it cools too quickly it will start forming unwanted crystals, typically type IV, causing early fat bloom.  Once set you gradually warm back to room temperature.  Sugar bloom is initiated when the surface temperature of the chocolate is below the dew point temperature for the room.  You see it on the surface of a glass of ice water.  This moisture formed will start to dissolve the sugars.  One percent moisture will create three percent syrup.  This surface syrup then dries out and crystallizes, giving you the sugar bloom.

I'm commenting on this thread b/c I think we have a similar problem (our exterior environment is not as humid right now (in a few months it will be high) but still perhaps too much & too high of room temp.) For our last few batches (and after reading this as well as other sources), I believe we have lots of sugar bloom - white dots, tackiness, and crumbliness. We've been following the practice of putting the moulds into the fridge to "set" the crystals in the chocolate. Is this the best practice to use in the first place? However, I do think it is when we take it out of the fridge to room temperature (70F) that the problem arises. Would 65F room temp be reasonably low enough for the moulds & chocolate to come back up gradually? Or, could we leave the moulds out at that or another temperature and avoid the fridge all together?

I accidentally added an extra 75% cream than what was called for to a caramel I made recently.  While texturally it seems fine right now, I wonder if there might be any negative impact in the shelf life?  Perhaps it will just have better, richer taste?  Better 'stand up' quallity?  Would you use it?  Thanks!

Hi Joe,

Thank you for sharing your formula, i will have to try it tomorrow and let you know how i like it. 

Maybe its done that way commercially by the big guys because its easier for foil wrapping machines to fold against a flat back? And then its just become the norm - no idea.

But its a valid point.

Hi Clay - great site and thanks for all your work to get it running and with your troubleshooting.

A couple of things I've noticed about the Groups:

1: as Ben mentions above, the discussion threads are sorted by Start Date rather than Last Contribution Date.

2: I don't seem to be getting e-mail notifications for new Group discussion threads when they are started like I did with the old site (I've tried looking through my profile to make sure everything is set to send me e-mails, but maybe I've missed some notification setting).

I've never understood why almost everyone does this. Utterly weird.

Hi Clay, 

I just noticed something when doing a search. I did a search on 'pricing' looking for an old thread to send to a friend and several of the results didn't display a title or link. So, it was impossible to actually click through to the thread.

There are a couple on the third page of results:

https://www.thechocolatelife.com/search/results/jrForum/3/10/search_string=pricing

There's one by me and one further down by Matt Caputo that aren't working. There's also one on the second page of results.

Thanks,
Ben

May I ask why dextrose is used in your recipe? I've not used it before and just curious.

Thanks

Hi Paul & Emma, thanks for selling Original Beans Chocolove, Vera

Hello, we are paul & emma and we are Chocoladeverkopers - dutch for chocolatesellers. We started last november selling chocolates in our own part of a store in a lovely street in Nijmegen, The Netherlands.

We sell dark bars by amongst others Marou, Chocolatemakers, Tibor Szántó & Original Beans. We started our little business because we love dark chocolates and because we want to make the world a tiny bit better. That's why we only want to sell bars we like ourselves, we prefer bars that are made by companies who think carefully about what they do and their impact on the world. Also, we get all our bars by bicycle (currently from Amsterdam, Wageningen & Heteren).

We really have a lot to learn, and i think this site is one of the good places for that - that is the main reason to make an account here. 

Thanks for your attention & wishing you all the best in your chocolate adventures,

Paul & Emma

www.chocoladeverkopers.nl

facebook.com/chocoladeverkopers

You mention that they develop a powdery texture, and that you have high humidity.  Look for sugar bloom.  When you hold the bar, does the bloom remelt or remain, and when tasting the surface is it the dry powder you describe.  To prevent, after you cool the chocolate, let rewarm gradually, keeping product above the dew point for room conditions.  It doesn't take much moisture to condense on the surface to cause the problem.

thank you all are very friendly and I wish them well and many positive vibes!

gracias muchas!

shopmodpac.com

Thanks Sebastian. I will look for a set screw refrig.

The issue i suspect you're having is one of sugar bloom, and that results from condensation.  You get condensation when something cold runs into warm air (warm air contains more water than cold air) - and when the warm, wet air hits the cold chocolate, that decrease in air temperature means the air can't hold the excess moisture, and it promptly deposits itself on your bar.  When it does so, it dissolves some sugar in your chocolate, and then it eventually evaporates and leaves behind the dissolved sugar that looks now like white film.

Your typical consumer fridges have thermostats that aren' meant to go as high as 55 - some models have a cowling that, if you remove the cover, there's a set screw that you can turn to further adjust the range of the condensing unit to enable it to achieve warmer temperatures - its a trial and error thing as there's no gradations on the set screw (and not all modesl have it) - you just have to turn it, put a thermometer in there and read it 4 hours later to see what's happened.  If yours has the set screw, it's the least expensive way to modify your fridge.  If not,  you can replace the thermostat - it's not hard to do, but not everyone's comfortable cutting wires.

A very helpful tool for managing condensation is a psychrometric chart - big scary word, the chart itself is also scary looking, but once you understand how to read it, will help you understand what the temperatures of your fridge (or the room  your fridge is in) need to be to minimize the odds of condensation.

A Cool Bot will control an air conditioner to make your own cold room.

box and wraps.

Papermart.

Thanks fo the info.

I put in 10-15 minutes and refrig. temp is 48F.

I tried to cool in at RT and found out it won't release off the mould....

I will definately check the DIY cooling tunnel.

I wonder if anyone came across refrig unit that can be adjusted to 55F. ( My mom in law's wine cooler is definately 55F capable, but too small and too expensive...)

Some where on the site here Clay posted plans for a DIY Cooling tunnel. I Tryed bulding something like it and it did a pretty good job for us. Came in around $800

Try a hair dryer and microfiber cloth...

Hi there, Nashville wraps and the rever group both sell wrapping stuff if that is what you are looking for!

That would be great, We always like to try new things around here. You could send a sample to our shop here. 

Starchild Chocolate

101 N Main St Willits, Ca 95490 USA

Hi Ash,

I can provide you with certified organic Inian Cocoa

Kindly let me know if you would like a sample

Regards

any recommendation for cleaning the molds?

thanks

Hello Everyone, I can recommend a website that sells wrappers or boxes for chocolates. thank you all

 We would be willing to try your beans provided they are certified organic. I have yet to try an Indian bean.

How long are you leaving it in the fridge?  I generally put it in for 10 to 15 minutes when it is actively crystallizing to carry off the latent heat of crystallization - then take it back out to room temperature.  Too long, it gets too cold and moisture will condense on the surface causing sugar bloom.  

Room temperature may result in the latent heat causing some pieces to get thrown out of temper.

Anything between a couple of hundred grams and 5 kgs.