Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
well, i love olives so it's a good bet i'll try this one!
Forum Activity for @Molly Drexelius
Posted in: Tasting Notes
well, i love olives so it's a good bet i'll try this one!
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
It's taken a while to perfect our Kalamata Olive Caramel, but by jove I think we've got it. It's our second-bestselling flavor now. www.TheXocolateBar.com
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
I tried this Vosges Mushroom bar in Feb 09 and I didn't like it at all! Not because of the mushroom, I couldn't even taste that. It's mushroom powder, not pieces. It was just weak, and I didn't like the walnuts.I rated it 2 out of 10. Way too expensive for what you get.
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
i have been given bars from Japan, but I cannot read the package! I know one was green tea -- it was like a KitKat bar covered with infused white chocolate. Not something I'd go for again. There was also a bar I think was tiramisu and another that was coffee. Both were candy sweet and were layers of milk and dark.I recently tried an olive oil truffle at the FFShow in SF, but I didn't like the combo -- i look forward to trying some of the items mentioned here!
updated by @Molly Drexelius: 09/08/15 23:07:39
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
i recently was given Kimchi chocolate that is made by a company in Koreait is more bizarre than disgusting tastes like the flavor packages of instant noodles mixed with white chocolate and coated in Dark...
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Have any of you tried Vosges new Enchanted Mushroom bar ?Organic dark chocolate + reishi mushrooms + organic walnuts. 66% cacao.I'd especially like to see Susie Norris' reaction.
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
I've also tried the Vosges bacon one. This is basically a play on the salty-sweet idea. (Like the whole white chocolate w/caviar that came out a few years ago within the context of molecular gastronomie). It was not bad (at first) but the bacon lefta long, lingering aftertaste that I found to be bitter and unpleasant. I feel that this is the sort of inclusion that can really distract someone from the quality of the chocolate- a good thing if/when the chocolate is mediocre...I guess; more likely a waste of really good chocolate. What I'm saying is that while saltiness can complement chocolate, it can also confuse the taster and take the fun out of searching for subtle hints and notes. That said, I've been enjoying some of those "fleur de sel" bars lately. Anyone else? I find that to be a lot more straight forward than the bacon; just play with the salt and forget the pork. The chocolate can then shine through.
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
In a shop in Bruges called Chocolate Line I tasted a pizza chocolate - sundried tomatoes and olives which was interesting. He also did a tobacco chocolate using the Papua New Guinea Becolade origin chocolate which already has quite a strong tobacco taste. Room for improvement thought.One of the weirdest I've made lately is a ganache with the south indian spices - curry leaves, mustard seed, chili's, coriander, turmuric, sambhar powder and asafedita. It was a love it or hate it sort of thing. I loved it, hubby hated it!
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Weirdest so far was cigar truffle by a Swedish chocolatier. Made from real cigars. As I don't smoke, I could only appreciate the taste intellectually; while it was a good blend, the aftertaste was like licking an ash tray (in my opinion - the smokers liked it).Runner up has to be lobster truffle.
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
The most interesting, unusual, and surprisingly delightful flavor combination I've tried is Theo's Coconut Curry Bar in their 3400 Phinney Line. Yumm.
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
So, what is "weird" to those of us who live and breathe chocolate is probably pretty different from what is weird to the general public. I have noted that there are still many people who come into my shop or by our farmer's market booth who react to some flavors as "weird" that all of us would consider old hat. That is fun, getting to see skepticism turn to enthusiasm, even if it is something very basic to me.When I see what I think is a weird flavor, it is like a mental puzzle-- how did that chocolatier get there--what were they thinking, how does it work? I learn a lot that way. I am still stumped by one flavor I heard of from a London chocolate shop-- tobacco. I can see how that might work flavor wise- the smokey, bitey intensity of tobacco makes sense with chocolate, yes. But what I remember about consuming tobacco (as a teenager exploring "chew") is that it made me barf. So, how does a tobacco chocolate not make you physically sick?
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Some combinations I've had which I thought were "out of the box"Vosges's Mo's Bacon Bar: oddly the salty smoky bacons works really well with chocolate. Think chocolate chip pancake breakfast minus the pancakes!Vere's Anise Espresso Bar: The licorice-like flavor of the anise worked nicely with the dark chocolate.Like Cybele, I also tried Japan's Pumpkin (as in actual Kabocha Squash) Kitkat. I LOVED it.I also really love the combination of tea and chocolate. Vosges Matcha bar is really nice, as is Chuao's Earl Grey. I'm just WAITING for someone to do a white chocolate with Chamomile tea.
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
DeBrands "Sweet Potato Pie" bar was probably the weirdest I've had. Not even sure if they are using actual sweet potatos.
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Here are a few of my thoughts on atypical flavors.I think cheese & chocolate are a great combination, though I admit that I scrunched my nose the first few times. (Chocolate as a savory was quite a welcome education for me.)Of course it's not really that surprising. My mother likes to make chocolate dipped cream cheese squares.I've had a few of Chuao's cheese items. (I think a goat cheese & pear william piece was the most recent) and their stout ganache and the olive sphere Clay mentioned.I enjoy Jeff's blue cheese truffle (I ate one last night!) and many of the uses of chili peppers and chocolate. (Though some are far too spicy for me that it kind of messes up the decadent aspect.)I've tried a few of the Zotter bars as well, though I stuck to the traditional flavors ... you know, things like bananas and curry & citron and polenta.I really like Theo's Bread & Chocolate, which has little bread bits in there, a little on the salty side.There are a few chocolatiers using balsamic vinegar - it's kind of like tangy jam in the end. I don't mind pop rocks. The first time I had that combo was at a CocoaBella event when Christopher Elbow & Chuck Siegel made a peanut butter praline' with pop rocks in it. The next year, Elbow came out with his pop rocks bar (I haven't tried it yet, but it's in the chocolate fridge).I think I had someone's chocolate covered spiced corn nuts, but at the moment I can't remember who made them (oh no! my brain is too full of chocolate!) ... maybe that was Chuao as well.I had a sun dried tomato & chocolate piece a few months ago, but honestly, it tasted just like raisins.L'Artisan du Chocolat here in Los Angeles has a kalamata olive, but I think the coolest one was a vodka and cucumber - tasted like "fresh".One of the oddest consumer candies I think I've had (besides durian taffy) would be the Pumpkin KitKat. Not pumpkin spice, but pretty much a squash cream & milk chocolate KitKat.The Root Beer piece from Michael Mischer (which I picked up at your recommendation last week, Clay) is certainly one of the odder combos.Even Koppers has a fun line of chocolate drops called Savouries - cayenne, black pepper, rose, curry, thyme, orange blossom - which isn't really that innovative in today's market compared to some things, but certainly more affordable than many others.Vosges does quite a few uncommon combinations. I like the spices, especially the cardamom truffle called Ellateria, but the wasabi (black pearl) didn't work for me.The whole bacon thing is lost on my as I don't eat pork. I think I'd plotz if I saw something like salmon roe and chocolate.As long as no one starts covering those Bertie Bott's Every Flavor Jelly Beans in chocolate, I think a little trial and error is a good thing.
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
We do a blue cheese stuffed black mission fig on a candied pecan. I guess it is weird, but it rocks! It is all about balance, baby!
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
I cannot believe I forgot to mention that one!
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Getting Smoked Blue Cheese to actually work was hard. And it certainly qualifies as weird
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
A chef who had gone to Italy brought back a bar of chocolate with cactus pear in it. One bite was enough. I couldn't bring myself to ear more as it tasted perculiar at best.
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
The folks over at Chuao Chocolatier have a great program where they solicit flavor suggestions from employees and customers. I was out in California about two years ago visiting their then-new manufacturing plant (too big to be a workshop, too small to really be called a factory) and Michael shared with me a piece that was suggested to them this way:A small dark chocolate egg filled with a dark chocolate ganache made with olive oil and flavored with lemon (including the peel) and very small pieces of sun-dried tomato.In a word: YUM!
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
hmm, well i didn't think the last bar i had was that strange--lemon, pepper in white. but i think they forgot to label it correctly as puke-flavored. that's a pretty weird flavor.
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
The tomato, basil, and mint truffle by B. T. McElrath has been one my top experiences as far as filled chocolates. I also was recently given a sample of a bar from L'Artigiano that was salted milk chocolate with a hint of olive oil, that I would really want to try again and review for The Chocolate Note. I already reviewed McElrath, read it here . I am about to review an interesting sheep's milk dark chocolate from Choco-Lina.Otherwise I've had and enjoyed some of the usual unusuals -- balsamic, curried coconut, habanero, etc.
Weird Flavors and Inclusions in Chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
What's the weirdest flavor/inclusion combination you've not only heard of in chocolate but have actually eaten?Inquiring chocolate minds want to know.I will start things off by saying that I think the Austrians are among the most adventurous when it comes to flavors in chocolate.I used to think it was the Spanish when I was tasting the work of Enric Rovira (chocolate covered corn-nuts, pretty good actually) and Oriol Balaguer (the saffron truffles were definitely an acquired taste, and it was a lot of fun to give someone his pop-rocks chocolate without telling them what it was ...).Lately, however, I think the prize has to go to Zotter. I took a look at a bar with an asparagus or artichoke and something or other filling and decided instead (whatever possessed me I do not know) to try the mustard and coffee bar. It wasn't nearly as bad as it sounds, thought it is not something I would buy for myself (I got mine at Fog City News in SF) ever again.There is another Austrian company I have heard of that is making camel's milk chocolate for sale in the middle east. I would definitely try it (at least once) just to know how it tasted different from cow's milk.
updated by @Clay Gordon: 10/11/21 18:16:10
Reach Out, Lend a Hand - The Chocolate Life Microfinance Fund
Posted in: Opinion
Kiva.org provides an innovative funding mechanism offering micro-finance opportunities to entrepreneurs around the world.One such Kiva entrepreneur is Miriam Paredes . Miriam is looking for funds to purchase ingredients and supplies to enable her to expand her chocolate business, which is in La Paz, Bolivia. So far, Kiva members have lent her $50 of the $800 she is seeking. This is not the first time Miriam has asked for help through Kiva, and she has an excellent record of paying back her loans on time.TheChocolateLife Microfinance fund will provide micro-finance loans to cacao, cocoa, and chocolate entrepreneurs - like Miriam - throughout the world through Kiva.org. Loans to Kiva entrepreneurs will be repaid to TheChocolateLife Microfinance fund, and will be reinvested in suitable projects.All supported projects will be highlighted in this forum thread. Make your contribution today by clicking on the "ChipIn" button in the widget near the bottom of the right-hand column. ChipIn is a service that help people raising funds for projects.:: ClayPS. I am supporting this fund by paying the PayPal transactions charges (ChipIn uses PayPal as the means to get donations to recipients), which are roughly 3%. So, when you donate $25, your entire $25 will go to the fund, not $25 less the transaction fees.
updated by @Clay Gordon: 04/17/15 13:07:59
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Yes, it does. I have some new drawing software and I will see if I can do something with that to illustrate the idea.
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Maybe different linear graphs: one for the initial taste, one for the middle section and another for the aftertaste. The shape of the graph line indicates strength and length and the colour of the line - or a written note - tells you what the flavours are. Or maybe coloured bar graph blocks underneath for each flavour.Hmmm, this does get tricky when you get past the first thoughts doesn't it!
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Jo:I'd thought about extending the metaphor to include a literal music staff but everything I tried to do was more difficult to use than the spider graphs. I am still open to the idea but what is important is that whatever the visual form is:1) It's easy to grasp - and quickly2) It's easy to compare - meaningfully - with other chocolate graphsIt's a fun challenge.:: Clay
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
What about musical staff notation? A "measure" is a period of time. Each line on the staff could represent different "notes" of flavor. Intensity for each flavor could be color coded. The notes could be standardized ( a la TCHO) or the chocolate maker would give their "tasting notes" as they perceive them. Depending on the complexity of the chocolate, there could be one measure, or there could be a symphony. Each time a "flavor note" emerges, the note on the staff would appear with the corresponding color for the intensity of that flavor.The best chocolates would probably have a score, where each instrument has it's own staff for the complex flavor notes.Unfortunately if most of the world does not know how to listen a symphony, they probably couldn't read the sheet music.I'm reminded of a line out the movie "White man can't jump". I'm not going to quote it exactly but it was something to the effect of : you can listen to Jimi (i.e. Hendrix), but you can't HEAR Jimi.
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Evert-Jan:This discussion is always open. I haven't spent much more time writing about it because I still haven't figured out how to visualize things properly and (good, clear) pictures are helpful when trying to explain abstract concepts.The music analogy I was referring to is ADSR - Attack Decay Sustain Release - as I mention in an earlier reply. Some more detail:Attack: How quickly does the chocolate flavor develop?Decay: How quickly does it fall off?Sustain: Once the flavor decays, what happens?Release: How does the long aftertaste develop?If you try to graph this there the horizontal axis it time, you end up with a curve that displays the way the flavor changes over time in the mouth. Because some chocolates are aromatic and bright and others are earthy, I would start the curve on different places on the vertical axis to try to represent that aspect.This is inexact which is why I am still working on it.
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
hi Clay, Olorinis this interesting idea of new ways to talk on chocolate still running?any outcomes to share / further collaborate on ?cheersEvert-Jan
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
I've found the taste wheels to be useful, but they do have limitations. To me, the biggest benefit is the breakdown into the broad family/category and then the specific taste descriptions. If I can start with the category that helps me narrow down what the specific taste might be. One limitation of these wheels, though, is that the categories are somewhat arbitrarily named and don't match from wheel to wheel. I also find it hard to have to read around a circle. Also, some wheels have descriptors that others lack. It was easier for me to compile these from several wheels into one list. Looking at a list of words grouped by categories is easier for me to use. I've attached my list. I've also attached a file with a few tasting wheels, if those work well for you.
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
On Chloe Chocolat there is her tasting guide , which is a pdf excerpt from her book. You can save this as a pdf file for yourself, so that's the download part.If you scroll down you'll find her version of a tasting wheel. I find it most useful how these wheels are grouped by "Aroma families" and then the specific aromas within that.
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Much as I respect Chloe's ability to taste, I don't think it's possible to credit her with the invention of the various taste wheels used in chocolate. At a minimum, they are borrowed from wine. Chloe must have taken the concept and created her own version of it for her book.Curious - who is "we?" And, can you please post links to the site and to the download link so that other members can do the same?Thanks,:: Clay
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
I thought the "taste wheel" came from Chole Doutre-Roussel's web site and/or recent publication. I'd have to hunt a bit for it; but I'd suggest visiting her sight and/or downloading an excerpt of her new book. As I recall, that is how we came accross this helpful wheel w/ terminology.AO
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Sabrina:I suppose the graphs could be standardized but that would require agreement among manufacturers, who won't do it unless they see a real value.I think the underlying answer is one you hint at ... which is that no one representation works best for everyone. People have very different ways of processing information and find some formats naturally easier to interpret than others.What I want to do is avoid the need for multiple graphs - which may be impossible. There are a number of ways to express the information and the spider graphs use only one (a 2D plane). I don't think that going to 3D is the right way to do this, but the width of a bar or line could mean something as could a change in color and the position (for example) of the horizontal axis on the vertical one.The tongue-view is interesting but, you're right, it's too personal. A supertaster would draw a very different map from someone with very few taste buds. I don't know that the Sousa vs NIN comparison is the right one but I do think it's in the right direction. A chocolate could be "symphonic" meaning that it had a lot of complexity in taste, texture, attack, and release. We could use that term without saying what kind of symphony it was. (e.g., a romantic composer like Rachmaninoff has a different overall feel from a modern composer like Stravinsky). We could compare that with a chamber orchestra or a duet or a solo - or rock with folk. That might work.Whatever it ends up being, I don't think it will be "it." It will be more than one.
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
I agree that the spider graphs are too obtuse and inacessable, but I like your idea about drawing on the language of music.I picture a bar of music with the different notes representing the development of flavors, the higher the note, the more intense, the longer the note the longer the flavor lasts.Music is something that is easily recognizable by almost everyone (even if they can't actually read music, which I can't) but still I would be able to hear the chocolate singing.
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
couldn't the spider graphs be standardized somewhat easily? maybe a few more simple characteristics added on. even milk and dark chocolate could have the same words, potentially. i.e. caramel a 9 for milk, a 4 for a dark, etc...
i like the visual idea of the spider graph. alcohol, bitter, fruity, nutty, coffee, 'chocolatey', caramel, intensity...maybe that's enough? maybe a partnered x/y graph of the when the intensity exists..or what about where the flavor hits on the tongue? a sweet picture of a tongue with different colors might work..or be weird. i know i like the flavor to hit everywhere. some like it better on the tip of the tongue. but maybe the same bar hits different tongues in different places for everyone..
i'm not so sure about the music qualifications--i don't think they work well with me, at least. maybe if it were like "john phillips sousa"--bam! and then soften and go on and on...or "trent reznor"--quiet quiet louder louder LOUDEST EVER quiet quiet....just brainstorming.
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Thanks. Now I see what you mean. Yes, those aren't very useful and they're useless for comparing two graphs.
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
This is the "spider graph" for Felchlin Maracaibo Clasificado 65%:
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
QUOTE: "I am really unhappy with the spider graphs that many chocolate manufacturers use"----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Clay,What do you mean by "spider graphs"? Are these the tasting wheels or something else? I'm not sure what you're referring to.
Describing chocolate
Posted in: Tasting Notes
Hmmm... bars are cheap, fast, and easy. So with this "sexy" metaphor what does that make truffles?